At Podcast Movement Evolutions, the podcast industry demonstrated a significant shift towards video content. A report by Amplify Media and Coleman Insights revealed that 77% of podcast consumers now engage with both audio and video content, challenging previous assumptions about media consumption. The research highlighted that only 10% of Gen Z listeners are pure audio consumers, with social media and platforms like YouTube becoming critical for podcast discovery.
The conference featured discussions about the evolving podcast ecosystem, including challenges in measurement and monetization. Experts like Dan Granger from Oxford Road emphasized the need for an open measurement protocol and standardized data reporting across platforms. Other key discussions centered on the potential of subscription models, with platforms like Patreon and Substack showing growing interest in podcast-related revenue streams.
Industry leaders and podcasters explored various emerging trends, including the role of AI, the importance of community engagement, and the potential future of podcasting. Keynote speakers like Tom Webster discussed the need to convert occasional listeners into more frequent consumers, while podcasters like Matt Maher highlighted the growing significance of video in podcast discoverability and audience connection.
77% of podcast consumers now consume both audio and video content, indicating a significant shift in podcast consumption preferences
Social media has overtaken friends and family as the primary method of podcast discovery, with YouTube and short-form platforms like YouTube Shorts and Instagram Reels leading the way
Most podcast listeners are not exclusively audio or video consumers, with only 16% listening to audio-only content and 7% watching video-only podcasts
Podcast platforms currently lack standardized measurement metrics, creating challenges for advertisers and content creators in understanding audience reach and engagement
Emerging platforms like Patreon and Substack are expanding beyond simple subscription models to offer multi-functional community experiences including podcasting, live streaming, and blogging
The podcast industry is increasingly focusing on video content, with creators and platforms investing heavily in video production and distribution strategies
The BBC has decided not to enter the UK podcast advertising market, preserving the ecosystem for independent podcasters
Podcasting is gradually transitioning from an advertising-only revenue model to a more diverse monetization approach, including direct listener support and premium subscriptions
"If we thought that Gen Z was leading the way and they were the ones primarily using YouTube, this dispels that most people, just about everybody is some combination of audio and video, regardless of age." - Steven Goldstein
- Challenges assumptions about generational video consumption and highlights the widespread adoption of multi-format content across age groups.
"For the first time we see that social media took over friends and family for number one [podcast discovery]. And that of course can be attributed to the fact that YouTube has become a powerhouse in this space and the ascent of short form platforms have become really, really important in the discovery play." - Jay Nachlis
- Reveals a significant shift in how people discover podcasts, emphasizing the growing importance of social media and short-form content.
"Do we want podcasting to become a subset of video? TV shows will always remain. Movies will always remain. But do we want podcasting [to be like] the same thing that happened to Instagram where it became a video app, not a photo app?" - Alban Brooke
- Provocative critique of the current push towards video podcasting, questioning whether podcasting should fundamentally change its nature.
"Podcasting is growing, but it's not growing quite as fast as maybe we would like podcasting to be growing. He was talking very much around the need to convert occasional listeners to more frequent consumers." - James Cridland (describing Tom Webster's keynote)
- Highlights the current challenge in podcast growth and the need to convert casual listeners into dedicated podcast consumers.
Chapter 1: The State of Video Podcasting in 2025
This chapter explores research from Amplify Media and Coleman Insights about podcast consumption trends, revealing a significant shift towards combined audio and video content across different age groups. The research highlights that most podcast consumers are engaging with both audio and video formats, challenging previous assumptions about generational media consumption.
- Most podcast consumers are using both audio and video formats, regardless of age group.
- Social media platforms, especially YouTube and short-form content, are now the primary method of podcast discovery.
Key Quotes
"Only 10% of Gen Z are pure audio only. 16% of the whole sample 15 to 64 was only audio. And on the other side of the spectrum, meaning only video, only 7% of either of those age groups." by Steven Goldstein
- This quote precisely captures the research's core finding about multi-format podcast consumption across age groups
"For the first time we see that social media took over friends and family for number one. And that of course can be attributed to the fact that YouTube has become a powerhouse in this space and the ascent of short form platforms have become really, really important in the discovery play." by Jay Nachlis
- This quote highlights the significant shift in podcast discovery mechanisms through social media platforms
Chapter 2: Podcasting's Growth and Challenges
This chapter discusses the current state of podcasting, featuring insights from Tom Webster's keynote and discussions about the medium's growth, challenges in listener conversion, and the ongoing debate about video's role in podcasting. The conversation explores whether podcasting is developing into a sustainable and habitual medium for consumers.
- Podcasting needs to focus on converting occasional listeners into more frequent consumers.
- There is a significant debate about whether podcasting should fully embrace video or maintain its core audio storytelling identity.
Key Quotes
"Do we want podcasting to become a subset of video? TV shows will always remain. Movies will always remain. But do we want podcasting the same thing that happened to Instagram where it became a video app, not a photo app?" by Alban Brooke
- This quote eloquently articulates the concern about podcasting potentially losing its unique audio storytelling identity
Chapter 3: Podcast Measurement and Industry Standards
This chapter delves into the challenges of podcast measurement, discussing the lack of standardized metrics across platforms and the need for an open, transparent measurement protocol. Representatives from Oxford Road and various industry experts highlight the importance of developing consistent first-party data reporting mechanisms to support podcasting's advertising potential.
- The podcast industry lacks standardized measurement metrics across different platforms.
- Developing an open measurement protocol using structured data could help solve current reporting challenges.
Key Quotes
Note: This transcript was automatically generated using speech recognition technology. While we will make minor corrections on request, transcriptions do not currently go through a full human review process. We apologize for any errors in the automated transcript.
It's
Friday
the
4th
of
April,
2025.
This
is
the
POD
News
Weekly
Review
live
live
at
Podcast
Movement
Evolutions
with
James
Kridland
and
Sam
Sethi.
I'm
James
Kridland,
the
editor
of
POD
News.
And
I'm
Sam
Sethi,
the
CEO
of
Truth
and
Suffering.
Massive
FOMO
at
the
moment,
but
we'll.
Find
out
why
later
in
the
chapters.
Today,
the
POD
News
Report
card
by
Pod
News,
the
state
of
video
podcasting
by
Amplify
Media
and
Coleman
Insights.
What
a
podcast
from
Oxford
Road
and
Edison
Research
and
even
Patreon
Substack
and
Netflix
are
leaning
into
podcasting.
And
Spotify
announcing
more
proprietary
ad
tech
as
well.
This
podcast
is
sponsored
by
buzzsprout
with
the
tools,
support
and
community
to
ensure
you
keep
podcasting.
Start
podcasting.
Keep
podcasting
with
Buzzsprout.com
from
your
daily.
Newsletter,
the
Pod
News
Weekly
Review.
Right,
James,
let's
kick
it
off.
So
last
week
we
had
the
infinite
dial
2025,
and
this
week
we
have
three
more
esteemed
noteworthy
reports.
The
first
one
was
just
done
at
Evolutions.
It
was
from
Amplify
Media
and
Coleman
Insight.
What
was
the
report,
James?
Well,
the
report
was
really
good.
Both
Jay
and
Steve
have
just
been
on
stage
and
they
talked
very
much
about
audio
being
healthy
and
thriving,
but
video
still
more
important
than
ever.
It
was
research
from
Amplify
Media
and
Coleman
Insights,
Stephen
Goldstein
and
Jay
Naklis,
revealing
that
77%
of
podcast
consumers
are
consuming
both
audio
and
video.
They
just
joined
me
here,
Steve,
which
is
nice.
Jay,
greetings.
Good
morning,
James,
great
to
see
you
as
always.
You've
just
been
on
stage.
What's
it
like
on
that
great
big
stage
in
there
with
your
numbers
and
everything?
It's
a
rush,
right?
I
mean,
putting
these
studies
together
is
an
experience
in
itself.
You
know,
I
think
we're
a
bit
like
kids
in
a
candy
store
when
you
extract
the
data.
And
anytime
you
find
a
finding
and
you
say,
oh,
that's
yes,
that's
something
we
need
to
share,
that's
something
we
need
to
share.
And
then
to
actually.
And
then
you
feel
like
you're
in
this
waiting
game
of
you've
done
the
analysis,
you've
put
everything
together,
and
you
just
can't
wait
to
share
the
data
and
see
people's
reactions.
Stephen
Goldstein
welcomed
us
with
an
excellent
joke
saying,
welcome
to
day
10
of
podcast
movement,
because
it
certainly
feels
like
it.
What
was
the,
what
were
the,
what
were
the
headlines,
Steve?
So
the
headlines
are
that
if
we
thought
that
Gen
Z
was
leading
the
way
and
they
were
the
ones
primarily
using
YouTube,
this
dispels
that
most
people,
just
about
everybody
is
some
combination
of
audio
and
video,
regardless
of
age.
So
only
10%
of
Gen
Z
are
pure
audio
only.
16%
of
the
whole
sample
15
to
64
was
only
audio.
And
on
the
other
side
of
the
spectrum,
meaning
only
video,
only
7%
of
either
of
those
age
groups.
So
everybody's
in
the
middle.
However,
before
we
get
to
the
point
of,
you
know,
anybody
listening
to
this
with
video
despair,
if
you
take
the
10%
of
Gen
Z
that's
audio
only
and
then
the
30%
of
Gen
Z
that's
primarily
audio,
you're
at
40%.
So
I
say
audio
is
alive
and
well
and
people
are
just
using
their
options
of
wherever
they
are
making
choice.
Jay,
you
showed
an
awful
lot
of
video
as
well
in
this,
in
this
presentation
about
video.
But
it
was
video
from
creators
talking
about
how
people
discover
shows,
how
people
are
promoting
shows.
What
were
the
takeaways
from
that?
Well,
vertical
video
or
clips
has
become
really
very
important.
And
when
it
comes
to
social
media,
I
mean
the
big
headline
was
we've
done,
you've
seen
research
projects,
we've
done
many
of
these.
And
when
you
talk
about
podcast,
Discovery,
friends
and
family
is
always
number
one.
And
for
the
first
time
we
see
that
social
media
took
over
friends
and
family
for
number
one.
And
that
of
course
can
be
attributed
to
the
fact
that
YouTube
has
become
a
powerhouse
in
this
space
and
the
ascent
of
short
form
platforms
have
become
really,
really
important
in
the
discovery
play.
So
shorts
is
bigger
than
ever.
I
think
sometimes
there's
people
that
sleep
on
shorts
a
little
bit
they
shouldn't.
And
the
other
thing
is
that,
you
know,
TikTok
is
important,
but
don't
sleep
on
reels.
That
is,
that
is
number
three
behind
YouTube
and
shorts.
So
I
think
that's
another
important
takeaway.
Yeah,
that
was
really
interesting
seeing
that
reels
does
so
well
and
that
TikTok
is
actually
below
that.
So
I
thought
that
was
fascinating.
Steve,
there
is
a
webinar
coming
up,
I
think
where
we
can
see
the
whole
data
and
find
out
more.
You'll
be
able
to
see
us
in
the
upper
right
hand
corner,
but
you'll
see
the
data
on
the
large
part
of
the
screen.
And
we
will
present
this
entire
thing
in
a
webinar
on
April
17th
at
2pm
and
you
can
go
to
either
Coleman
Insights
website
or
the
Amplify
Media
website
to
register.
And
there
is
one
other
thing
I
think
worth
discussing
and
that
is
Spotify.
So
here's
Spotify
having
made
the
big
video
move
at
the
end
of
2024,
compensating
artists
and
so
forth.
But
we
are
not
seeing
the
full
change
to
video
consumption.
Spotify
remains
a
primary
audio
medium
today.
Well,
fascinating
stuff,
Steve.
Jay,
thank
you
so
much
for
that.
Amplify
Media.
Amplify
spelled
A
M
P
L
I
or
Cullman
Insight
for
information
about
that
webinar.
Thank
you
both
so
much.
Sam.
Also
there
was
the
POD
News
report
card
of
course,
which
was
fun
because
I
ended
up
being
on
that
very
same
stage.
So
that
was
entertaining.
Yes,
I've
got
a
picture
of
you
on
it.
It's
very
nice.
Now
you've
been,
this
is
the
third
year
of
the
report
card,
I'm
correct
in
saying.
And
what
was
your
key
finding
then,
James?
Come
on,
Reve.
Well,
YouTube
scored
really
highly
all
of
the
scores
for
all
of
the
apps.
YouTube
ended
up
scoring
significantly
higher
numbers
than
last
year.
So
they
are
clearly
winning
creators
round,
which
is
an
interesting
thing
to
end
up
seeing.
Apple
continued
to
be
the
creator's
favorite
platform
though
in
the
apps
category,
the
independent
podcast
app
Pocketcasts
was
number
two.
Ellie
is
here
and
I
have
not
yet
managed
to
bump
into
her
to
tell
her
that.
But
yes,
really
good
news
from
all
of
that.
But
you
know,
fascinating
data.
It's
really
interesting
to
end
up
seeing.
And
what's
nice
from
my
point
of
view
is
that
all
of
the
big
platforms
are
now
asking
to,
to
learn
more
about
what
those
numbers
are.
And
again
given
that
Apple
was
number
one.
But
you,
you
had
some
more
data
on
there
as
well
about,
well,
let's
say
data
that
people
weren't
happy
with.
I
was
reading
some
of
the
things
I
don't
care
about
rss,
I
don't
care
about
this.
So
not
everyone
was
a
happy
Larry
in
your
report.
No,
and
I
think
that's
the
nice
thing
about
it
is
that
it
is
both
positive
and
negative.
You
get
the
gripes
from
the
keyboard
warriors
as
well
as
the
positive
things.
And
actually
quite
a
lot
of
the
time
if
you
go
and
have
a
nice
sit
down
meeting
with
Apple,
you
want
to
be
nice
to
them,
you
don't
necessarily
want
to
be
rude
to
them,
at
least
if
you're
not
me.
So
that's,
so
that's
always
fun.
But
from
that,
from
that
point
of
view,
yeah,
it's
nice
to
actually
see
the
unvarnished
truth,
you
know,
in
terms
of
that.
So,
you
know,
so
that,
that
was
quite
fun
to
do.
I
think
the
other
thing
I
would
like
to
highlight
from
your
report
is
our
friends
at
the
podcast
index
came
out
as
the
number
one
directory.
I
love
that
one.
Yeah.
And
always
coming
up
with
that
number
one
directory
as
well.
Matt
Maher
is
Here,
Matt
Maher
is
the
MC
of
Podcast
Movement.
You've
been
doing
this
for
years
and
years,
haven't
you?
A
decade.
A
decade.
Can
you
believe
that?
And
so
you
are
there
with
your
sparkly
trousers
as
of
yesterday
and
your
sparkly
top
as
of
today,
exciting
us.
What's
takeaway
from
Evolutions?
We
were
just
discussing
it.
Video.
Video.
Video,
Video.
I
think
if.
And
I
think
some
people
think,
oh,
well,
I
have
an
older
demographic
to
my
podcast.
They
don't
really
do
video.
And
what
I'm
learning
is
that
the
data
is,
no,
everyone
is
going.
Everyone
is
searching
and
yearning
for
video.
And
when
you
think
about
it,
I
think
it's
just
another
way
to
connect
with
your
listeners
and
for
them
to
feel
closer
to
you
and
build
that
community
that
we
do
so
well
as
podcasters.
You
do
a
podcast
yourself.
What's
the
name
of
the
podcast?
It's
called
Reality
Gaze.
And
in
terms
of
that
podcast,
how
much
video
are
you
doing
on
there?
Well,
for
us,
we
have
our
video.
It's
behind
our
paywall
of
our
premium
of
our
Patreon
and
Apple
subscriptions.
So
what
we're
realizing
now
is
that's
actually
the
thing
we
need
to
probably
lead
with
the
video
for
discoverability.
Matt,
thank
you
so
much.
And
thank
you
for
your
excellent
work
for
the
last
10
years.
Thank
you.
Thanks.
Okay,
I'm
going
to
say
it
if
you
won't.
God,
do
we
have
to
have
the
title
video
Kill
the
Podcast
style?
Because
it
bloody
well
feels
like,
oh,
I
do.
I
do
hope
not.
That
would
be.
That
would
be
a
dreadful
thing.
Hang
on
a
minute.
You
know,
we
talked
to
Megan
at
the
Infinite
Dial.
It's
all
video.
Lean
back
tv.
We
talked
to
Amplify
Steve
and
we
talked
to
Jay
Coleman.
It's
all
video.
And
now
you've
just
had
somebody
come
on
and
say
it's
all
video.
I
mean,
seriously,
there
is
an
awful
lot
of
video
talk.
It's
a
bit
like,
if
you
remember
a
couple
of
years
ago,
everybody
was
talking
about
AI.
This
time,
everybody
is
talking
about
video.
So,
yeah,
that
was.
That
was
definitely
one
of
the.
One
of
the
standout
things
there.
Now,
I
mean,
we're
going
to
talk
about
this
next
bit
in
a
minute
when
we
talk
about
Oxford
Road.
But
in
your
report
card,
there
was
also,
nobody
measures
the
same.
And
I
think
that's
worth
highlighting.
What
did
they
say
about
that?
Yeah,
exactly.
Right.
So
a
lot
of
people
saying,
you
know
what,
you
know,
Spotify
doesn't
measure
the
same
thing
as
Apple.
Apple
doesn't
measure
the
same
thing
as,
you
know,
YouTube
and
so
on
actually,
what
was
interesting
is
the
IAB
came
up
to
me
after
that
and
said,
we
would
love
to
learn
more
about
all
of
this.
And
so
that
is
a
very
welcome.
That's
a
very
welcome
move.
So,
yeah,
I
think
there's
real
understanding
now
that,
yes,
there's
an
awful
lot
of
detail
and
data
from
all
of
these
platforms,
but
it
is
very
difficult
to
merge
them
together.
And
that's
certainly
what
the
folks
at
Bumper
have
been
saying
as
well
in
terms
of
that.
So
if
I
wanted
to
read
the
full
report
card,
James,
where
would
I
go?
You
would
go
to
the
POD
News
website.
We
covered
some
of
the
PodTrack
data
that
we
covered
earlier
on
in
the
week.
And
as
well
as
the
report
card,
just
have
a
look
at
the
stuff
at
the
bottom
or
indeed
just,
you
know,
search
for
the
word
report
card
and
you
should
hopefully
find
it.
Now
there's
a
couple
other
people
talking.
Tom
Webster
was
talking
and
he
kicked
off
the
keynote.
What
did
Tom
have
to
say?
It
was
an
interesting
start
in
that,
you
know,
Tom
was
basically
talking
about
podcasting
is
growing,
but
it's
not
growing
quite
as
fast
as
maybe
we
would
like
podcasting
to
be.
To
be
growing.
He
was
talking
very
much
around
the
need
to
convert
occasional
listeners
to
more
frequent
consumers.
So
from
that,
from
that
point
of
view,
you
know,
it
was
a
good.
It
was
a
good
conversation.
But.
But
yeah,
you
know,
he
was
very
much
saying,
we've
got
to
focus
on
still
growing
our
medium.
And
that
was
quite
a
nice.
That
was
quite
a
nice
thing.
I
think
podcasting,
when
it
becomes
habitual,
is
very,
very
interesting.
And
we
all
know
that
it's
on
your
train,
car
or
dog
walk
where
most
people
consume
it.
No,
it
absolutely
is.
And
you
may
have
heard
the
music
has
gone
up
a
little
bit.
That's
because
I'm
now
inside
one
of
the
big
expo
halls
and
I
thought
it
was
only
fair
to
have
a
very
quick
ch
with
the
man
of
the
moment
from
our
sponsor,
Buzzsprout.
His
Alban
Brooke.
Alban,
greetings.
Thank
you,
James.
It's
nice
to
be
on
the
podcast.
Are
we
recording
POD
News
Weekly?
Yes.
Yes.
The
Pod
News
Weekly
review.
You're
live
on
the
POD
News
Weekly
review.
Please
do
not
swear.
So
this
is
no
sugar
added
Alban.
Brooke,
what's
your
thoughts
been
on
the
show?
Well,
we're
getting
to
meet
lots
people.
We
had
a
nice
Buzzsprout
meetup
last
night.
It's
good
just
to
see
everybody
and
check
in.
A
lot
of
walking.
The
hotel
is
a
little
bit
separated
from
the
conference
area,
so
I
know
we've
all
stayed
in
shape
and
gotten
our
steps.
Yeah.
Isn't
it
just.
What's
the.
What's
the
big
sort
of
takeaway
that
you
have
felt?
It's
been
quite
positive.
Quite
a
positive
feeling.
Conference.
Although
quite
a
lot
of
people
do
like
talking
about
the
word
video,
don't
they?
I've
heard
way
too
much
about
video.
I
think
that
I
hit
my
breaking
point
weeks
ago
and
hearing
more
about
video
convinces
me,
yes,
video
is
going
to
be
a
platform,
but
do
we
want
podcasting
to
become
a
subset
of
video?
TV
shows
will
always
remain.
Movies
will
always
remain.
But
do
we
want
podcasting?
The
same
thing
that
happened
to
where
it
became
a
video
app,
not
a
photo
app.
Do
we
want
Twitter,
which
became
a
video
app,
not
a
text
app.
Do
we
want
that
to
happen
to
podcasting?
And
I
think
the
answer
is
no.
We
have
a
unique
medium
around
audio
storytelling,
and
I
don't
think
we
should
just
give
that
up
to
become
a.
Subset
of
video,
I
think.
Hear,
hear.
So,
Alban,
thank
you
so
much
for
your
time.
I
will
let
you
get.
Before
he
goes.
Go
on.
Could
you
ask
Alban,
I'm
thinking
of
doing
an
RV
trip
across
America.
Is
there
a
company
he
would
recommend?
I
would
not
recommend
any
in
particular.
I
would
strongly
recommend
against
indie
campers.
Anybody
who
wants
to
know
my
full
review
can
go
read
any
number
of
angry
reviews
that
I've
left
over
the
last
few
weeks.
Yes,
the
Buzzcast
show
is
very
much
worth
a
listen
because.
Blimey.
Yet
that
was.
That
was
not
a
good
company.
Well,
I
am.
I'm
on
a
spite
mission,
as
Larry
David
would
put
it.
So
I'm
sure
there'll
be
more.
Posted.
Albin,
thank
you
so
much
and
thank
you
for
your
support
as
well.
I
appreciate
it.
Cheers.
So,
James,
one
of
the
other
reports
that
came
out
at
Evolutions
was
from
Oxford
Road
and
Edison.
Dan
Granger
spoke.
What
did
he
say?
I
thought
you'd
answered
this
question,
James.
What
is
a
podcast?
Why
is
everyone
still
asking
it?
Yeah,
exactly.
So
Dan
did
talk
about
what
is
a
podcast.
And
actually
he
has
done
an
awful
lot
of.
Of.
Of
hard
work
in
terms
of
working
out
what
a
podcast
is,
talking
to
a
lot
of
different
people
about
what
a
podcast
is.
And
so
he's
got
a
full
complicated
definition,
which
is
in
a
white
paper,
because
that's
the
way
that
Dan
Granger
rocks.
And
you
can
find
that
on
the
website.
So
that's
all
good.
And
also
he's
put
something.
He's
put
a
really
nice
documentary
into
the
Media
Roundtable.
And
the
Media
Roundtable
is
a
great
show
with
a
three
part
documentary
about
the
history
of
podcasting
and
what
a
podcast
actually
is.
And
it
was
kind
of
a
rallying
cry
really,
in
terms
of,
you
know,
in
terms
of
where
podcasting
is
actually
going.
Well,
I
read
the
whole
report
and
I
do
recommend
that
people
do
read
it
as
well.
You
can
get
a
link
from
POD
News
Daily.
But
the
questions
he
was
asking,
what
is
a
podcast?
I
don't
really
think
that
was
the
thing.
I
mean,
he
said
it's
audio
on
demand
or
it's
video
on
demand,
it
doesn't
really
matter.
The
things
that
people
were
saying
was
that
it
was
hard
to
share
podcasting
between
apps.
But
the
fundamental
bottom
line
of
what
he
was
asking
in
that
report
is
what
is
the
metric
we're
talking
about?
First
party
Data,
closed
walls,
YouTube
and
Spotify.
And
he's
saying
that
if
podcasting
and
advertising
is
to
grow
beyond
the
alleged
2
billion
mark,
then
we
need
a
better
way
of
reporting
and
measuring.
And
now
we've
talked
about
this
before.
John
Spurlock,
friend
of
the
show,
yourself,
me
and
a
few
other
people
are
talking
about
a
way
of
doing
that.
I,
you
know,
we'll
put
my
cards
out.
I
mean,
Dan
Grangers
called
it
an
open
measurement
protocol
for
podcasting.
There
is
a
way
of
doing
it,
and
I'm
currently
with
you
and
others
working
on
it,
which
is
using
something
called
activity
streams.
That's
a
first
party
structured
piece
of
data.
And
when
people
say,
oh
well,
no,
you
can't
use
that,
it's
a
bit
like
saying
RSS
don't
use
structured
data,
it's
xml.
Why
would
you
use
that?
Well,
it's
the
converse
side
of
it.
It's
what
apps
will
put
as
structured
Data.
It's
a
W3C
standard
and
it's
shareable.
And
I
think
that's
the
way
forward.
And
when
we
use
that
mechanism
for
sharing
first
party
data
between
apps
and
hosts,
I
think
we
do
have
an
industry
capable
standard
then.
Yeah,
I
think,
I
think
certainly
John
Spurlock
is
also
working,
he
was
here
as
well
earlier
on
in
the
week
and
I
know
that
he's
also
working
on
something
in
terms
of
that
as
well.
But
yeah,
lots
of
different
technical
solutions.
But
making
sure
that
people
are
measuring
the
same
thing
is
a
really,
you
know,
is
obviously
a
really
important,
important
thing
from
that,
from
that
point
of
view.
Yeah.
Moving
on
then,
James,
back
to
the
good
old
UK
for
a
while.
You
reported
a
couple
of
weeks
ago
about
the
BBC
turning
its
back
on
adding
advertising
into
its
podcast
after
a
lot
of
criticism
from
the
UK
podcast
industry.
Indeed.
What
is
outcome?
What's
the
outcome,
James,
now.
Well,
so
the
BBC
was
going
to
be
taking
advertising
in
the
UK
for
some
of
its
podcasts
if
you
didn't
listen
in
the
BBC
Sounds
app.
So
that
was
one
of
the
things
that
the
BBC
was
going
to
end
up
doing.
Cue
an
awful
lot
of
hue
and
cry
from
the
rest
of
the
UK
podcast
industry,
because
when
the
BBC,
one
of
the
biggest
publishers,
jumps
in,
and
that's
the
last
thing,
really,
that
anybody,
anybody
else
wants
to
lose
an
awful
lot
of
advertising
revenue.
So
from
that
point
of
view,
it's
very
good
to
hear
that
the
BBC
has
basically
said,
no,
we're
not
going
to
be
doing
that.
We're
not
going
to
be
stuffing
our
podcasts
full
of
ads
in
the
uk.
And
it
would
have
set
quite,
you
know,
a,
you
know,
a
precedent,
I
think,
in
terms
of
the
BBC's
output
in
the
UK.
So
good
news
all
round,
I
think.
Yeah.
Audio
UK,
we
had
Chloe
Straw
on
the
CEO
last
week.
She
came
out
and
said,
basically
from
them,
we
remain
strong
supporters
of
the
BBC
and
its
vital
role
within
the
UK's
podcast
and
audio
industry.
The
BBC
plays
an
important
part
in
the
industry
and
we
continue
to
support
its
funding
through
the
license
fee.
But
she
went
on
to
add,
we
remain
concerned
about
the
BBC's
entry
into
the
UK
podcast
advertising
market
through
content
produced
by
BBC
studios.
So
I
think
fundamentally,
everyone's
relieved
that
they
haven't
gone
down
this
road.
Do
you
think
it's
the
right
way?
Do
you
think
that's
the
right
decision?
Eventually,
yeah.
I
mean,
so
I
was
on
a
podcast
from
Roger
Bolton.
Now,
Roger
Bolton
used
to
present
feedback
on
BBC
Radio
4.
He
now
presents
his
own
podcast
called
Beebwatch,
where
he
can
dive
in
a
little
bit
more
deeply
into
some
of
these
things.
And,
yeah,
and
we
were
talking
about
what
the
BBC's
future
is
outside
the
UK
and
inside
the
UK,
and
I
think
very
clearly
the
BBC
inside
the
UK
is
funded
by
the
license
fee,
which
is
anachronistic
thing,
but
it
works
and
that's
fine.
Outside
of
the
uk,
funded
by
advertising,
you
know,
and
that's
a
good
thing
too,
in
terms
of
earning
more
cash
also,
by
the
way,
outside
of
the
uk,
it
is
earned,
if
you
want
to,
by
paying
for
the
Apple
podcasts,
premium
subscriptions
of
the
BBC's
content.
And
a
lot
of
people
are
doing
that
too.
So
all
of
that,
I
think
is
good.
But
I
think
when
the
BBC
starts
to
compete
in
terms
of
revenue
inside
the
uk,
then
I
think
commercial
organizations
should
cry
foul
because
The
BBC
has
3.6
billion
pounds
coming
in
from
the
license
fee.
That's
pretty
well
guaranteed.
And
one
thing
that
you
can
certainly
say
about
commercial
media
is
that
revenue
is
not
guaranteed.
You
know,
in
terms
of
that.
Again,
one
of
the
things
I
think
we
had
Chloe
on
last
week,
if
you
want
to
hear
more
of
what
she
thinks
the
audio
UK
role
is
in
guiding
the
industry
here
in
the
uk,
then
I
highly
recommend
listening
to
her
interview
on
last
week's
show.
Indeed.
And
you'll
also
find
that
interview
in
full
in
this
feed
as
well.
Weekly.podnews.net
Now,
James,
let's
move
on.
Patreon
seems
to
be
gaining
a
little
bit
more
momentum.
It
feels
like
that
to
me.
Anyway,
they
have,
they
have
said
that
the
highest
earning
category
on
patreon
now
with
6.7
million
membership
is
podcasting.
And
they've
launched
a
new
program
with
Sony
and
Wondry.
What
are
they
up
to?
Yeah,
they
appear
to
be
diving
into
podcasting
a
bit.
So
Sony
Music
and
Wondery,
you'll
be
able
to
buy
podcasts
on
the
Patreon
platform.
Listen
to
those
podcasts
in
your
favorite
podcast
app
and
all
of
that.
So
essentially
Patreon
turning
into
supporting
cast
a
bit.
So
interesting
to,
to
see
that,
that,
you
know,
that's
the
typical
mechanism
of
supporting
cast.
I
believe
that
Substack
does
much
the
same
sort
of
thing
the
Supercast.
Of
course,
there's
a
bunch
of
other
tools
which
allow
you
to
end
up
doing
that.
So,
yeah,
Patreon
jumping
in
and
with
some
really
high
numbers,
you
know,
I
mean,
6.7
million
memberships
and
I
think
Ashley
Carman
managed
to
get
a
total
value
out
of
them
as
well
in
the
Soundbyte
newsletter.
So,
yeah,
doing
very
well
in
terms
of
that.
Yeah.
For
2025,
I
think
my
three
words
are
content,
commerce
and
community.
And
I
think
we
are
seeing
Patreon,
Substack
and
others
really
going
down
this
road.
We
are
also
seeing,
I
think
with
Substack,
I
mean,
I've
been
watching
one
of
my
favorite
networks
is
Zateo
and
they
are
using,
and
quite
a
few
others
like
the
Midas
Touch,
they're
using
substack
for
live
broadcasting,
YouTube.
So
they're
using
YouTube
Live
and
then
they're
also
writing
their
blogs.
Well,
that's
interesting.
That's
interesting.
That
makes
it,
that
makes
a
ton
of
sense.
And
we're
seeing
Patreon
are
also
trying
to
go
down
the
live
road
as
well.
So
I
think
you're
beginning
to
see
what
I
call
multi
function
community
platforms.
Right.
So
they're
going
to
do
blogging,
podcasting,
video,
live
merch,
which
is
what
those
two
platforms
Offer
as
well.
And
I
fundamentally
think
any
single
function
app
now
is
probably
on
the
road
to
ruin.
Well,
there
you
go.
That's,
that's
a
bold,
a
bold
decision.
It's
not
my
prediction
yet.
That's
later
in
the
year.
No,
very
good,
very
good.
We're
sorry.
But
now
it's
time
for
more
news
about
Spotify
on
the
POD
News
weekly
review.
Oh,
good.
Oh,
brilliant.
Yes,
it's
time
for
more
news
about
Spotify
and
this
time
it's
time
for
news
about
Spotify
in
terms
of
their
monetization
model.
They've
got
a
bunch
of
new
tools
and
things
which
I
don't
fully
understand
in
terms
of
that,
but
they've
also
expanded
the
Spotify
Partner
program
to
a
further
nine
new
countries,
eight
of
those
in
Europe
as
well.
So
that
weirdly
means
that
even
Americans
will
earn
more
money
from
the
Spotify
Partner
program
for
reasons
that
I'm
not
fully
understanding.
But
yes,
definitely,
still
continuing
to
grow.
And
one
of
the
other
things
you
reported
on
this
week
was
about
a
company
called
Linus
Media
Group
and
they
shared
how
the
content
company
makes
money.
What
I
was
interested
in
from
that
was
the
revenue
from
YouTube
is
just
11%.
But
30.
Very
small.
Yeah,
but
37
from
a
revenue
share
with
YouTube
Premium.
So,
yeah,
if
we
go
back
over
what
we've
just
talked
about,
we
were
talking
about
Patreon
with
6.7
million
members.
We're
talking
about
substat,
we're
now
talking
about
YouTube
Premium.
We're
talking
about
Apple
channels
earlier
with
the
BBC
trying
to
monetize.
My
question
to
you,
James,
because
I
always
say
that
podcasting
is
this
second
class
digital
citizen.
You
know,
people
expect
to
pay
for
music,
films
and
audio
books,
but
they
don't
expect
to
pay
for
podcasting.
Are
we
jumping
now
to
a
point?
Are
we
reaching
that
tipping
point
where
people
are
saying,
actually
for
quality
content,
yes,
I
understand,
I
need
to
pay
for
it?
Yeah,
I
think
we
are
more
and
more,
and
I
think
Apple
is
certainly
helpful,
you
know,
in
terms
of
that.
Apple
has
very
much
driven
people's
understanding
of
a
premium
podcast
subscription.
You
know,
it's
a
paid
for
thing
which,
which,
which
people
understand.
And
of
course
you've
got
Patreon
and
you've
got
those
sorts
of
services
in
there
as
well.
So
I
think
that
people
are
beginning
to
understand
that,
yes,
you
know,
there
is
advertising
and
of
course
there's
advertising
and
that's,
and
that's
definitely
one
thing,
but
I
think
also
it's,
it's,
you
know,
other
ways
of
earning
money,
other
ways
of
giving
money
to
the
creators
that
you
really
enjoy.
And
if,
you
know,
as
we
see
from
Christian
broadcasting,
that
survives
essentially
on
people
just
giving
them
money.
So
yeah,
I
think
it's
a
good
thing.
I
think
it's
relatively
unhealthy
if
all
of
media
out
there
is
just
paid
for
by
advertising.
Moving
on,
James,
let's
whiz
around
the
world.
Over
to
you.
In
the
U.S.
hubbard
radio
have
announced
the
launch
of
a
Gamut
podcast
network.
What's
this
one?
Yes.
So
Hubbard
Radio
is
the,
is
a
hu.
It's
one
of
the
oldest
media
broadcasters
in
America
which
is
still
going.
It's
family
owned.
Ginny
Hubbard
is
the
CEO
and
she's
very
nice
and
I've
met
her
a
couple
of
times.
And
so
they
have
launched
their
own
podcast
podcast
network
which
is
called
the
Gamut
Podcast
Network.
And
Ginny
Hubbard,
I
mean
not,
you
know,
basically
saying,
look,
the
launch
of
Gamut
is
more
than
a
rebrand,
it'
pivotal
evolution
for
our
company.
That's
a
company
which
of
course
is
mostly
AM
FM
radio
stations.
So
interesting
to
see
that
that's
run
by
John
Wardock
who
is
here.
He's
been
around
over
the
last
couple
of
days
and
yeah,
so
it's
going
to
be
interesting
how
that
pans
out.
But
that's
exactly,
I
think
where
broadcast
radio
stations
should
be
going.
I
think
one
of
the
things
that
I
was
looking
at
because
I
went
to
the
Gamut
Podcast
network
and
it's
got
a
whole
bunch
of
podcasts.
I
went
to
Megan
Kelly's
network,
I
went
to
a
few
other
networks
that
have
launched.
One
of
the
things
I'm
frustrated
about
is
nobody
seems
to
be
explaining
what
publisher
feeds
are
or
pod
roles
and
again,
this
whole
thing
seems
to
be
missing.
Yes,
well,
I
don't
know
how
we.
Get
people
to
understand
these
things.
Yeah,
well
that's,
that's
one
of
the
issues
with
that
is
it's
an
issue
with
marketing
those
particular
features,
of
course,
and
that's
going
to
be
one
of
the
issues
there.
Now
Triton
Digital
is
to
expand
its
US
Podcast
Ranker.
What's
it
doing?
Well,
yes,
Triton
has
Sam
come
out
with
an
expansion
of
the
US
Podcast
Ranker
and
it's
now
including
all
publishers.
I've
literally
walked
outside
to
Triton
stand
and
I'm
wondering
if
I
ask
Darrel
very
nicely,
he
might
actually
explain
what's
going
on
with
the
new
expanded
Triton
podcast
ranker.
Darrell,
who
are
you
at
Triton,
first
of
all?
Hi,
James.
I
lead
measurement
analytics
at
Triton.
And
so
you
made
an
announcement
about
the
Triton
podcast
Rancor.
It's
now
going
to
measure
everybody
every
quarter.
As
I
understand
it,
we
do.
We
have
a
part
of
it
that
will
measure
everyone
based
on
surveyed
listeners
representative
of
the
U.S.
population.
Specifically,
we're
talking
about
the
U.S.
podcast
ranker.
We
will
keep
the
download
ranker,
which
requires
publishers
to
have
their
logs
measured.
And
then
we've
added
from
our
demos
+
solution
a
list
of
podcasts
that
reach
efficiently
or
over
index
for
different
audience
segments,
different
demographics,
income,
shopping
behaviors
or
purchase
intents
lifestyle
data,
which
is
a
resource
for
advertisers
to
help
understand
what
podcast
should
they
be
considering
for
their
buys.
Yeah.
So
you'll
be
able
to
look
at
podcasts,
I'm
guessing,
for
people
who
are
in
the
market
for
buying
a
new
car.
For
example,
which
podcast
are
they
listening
to
there?
Or,
or
podcasts,
you
know,
for
expectant
mothers.
That's
that
sort
of
thing.
Have
I
got
that
right?
You
got
the
in
the
market
to
buy
a
car?
I
don't.
We
have
moms
in
there.
I
don't
think
we
have
expecting
mothers.
Sometimes
they
want
to
keep
that
private
in
the
survey.
But,
but
the
general
idea
of
it
you've
got.
Right.
Yeah,
no,
that's
really
exciting.
And
so
when's
the
first
all,
you
know,
all
encompassing
ranker
coming
out?
Are
you
calling
it
a
rancor?
Are
you
calling
it
something
else?
And
we're
still
calling
it
the
US
Podcast
ranker,
even
even
though
the,
the,
the
component
about
the
audience
profiles
isn't
exactly
a
ranking.
It's
not
really
about
who's
number
one
versus
number
two.
It's
really
more
about
a
list
for
that
piece.
Still
a
ranker
coming
out
later
this
year.
We
don't,
we
haven't
reported
an
exact
month
yet.
Not
the
end
of
the
year,
it's
not
that
far
off.
But,
but
later
this
year.
Well,
it's
super
exciting.
Daryl,
thank
you
for
your,
for
your
time.
I
appreciate
it.
I'll
let
you
get
back
to
your
now.
Good
timing,
James.
I
know.
It's
almost
as
if
I
can
read
ahead
in
the
show
notes
and
work
out
what
you
want
to
talk
about
next.
Well,
let's
talk
about
something
else
next.
We've
been
reporting
over
the
last
few
weeks
about
people
who
are
not
declaring
that
they
are
charging
guests
to
be
on
their
show.
You
had
a
report
about
the
US
Advertising
self
regulator
saying
something.
What
was
that,
James?
Yes,
it
was
about,
it
was
about
social
media
influencers
who
were
basically
they've
been
caught
out
doing,
you
know,
posts
on
x
and
on
TikTok
and
stuff
and
not
being
obvious
as
to
where
their
data,
as
to
where
Their,
their
relationship
is
with
that
particular
company.
And
I
just
felt
that
it
was
interesting
in
that
there
is
clearly
more
and
more
eyes
on
that
side
of
things
and
so
something
that
we
just
need
to
be
a
little
bit
careful
of
in
terms
of
podcasting
as
well.
How
would
you
enforce
it?
I
mean,
this
is
the
problem
with
all
these
things,
right?
You
can
say
it,
but
how
do
you
enforce
it?
Well,
I
mean,
it
is
the
law.
And
so
the
Federal
Trade
Commission,
assuming
that
somebody
still
works
there
at
the
moment,
it
is
the
law.
So
there
are
fines
that
you
can
actually,
that
you
can
actually
pull.
But
the
typical
way
that
this
works
is
that,
you
know,
shows
will
be
reported
in
to
the
FTC
and
the
FTC
will,
you
know,
take
a
look
and
make
a
decision
on
that.
Moving
on
then,
James,
something
about
Podbean
running
deceptive
Ads.
That
doesn't
sound
good.
Yes.
Now,
Podbean
are
here,
but
I'm
absolutely
not
going
to
go
up
to
them
and
ask
them
about
this.
Go
on,
go
on.
No,
I'm
not
doing
that.
I'll
hold
your
coat
while
you
start
the
fight.
But
yeah,
yeah,
so,
you
know,
occasionally
you
have
to
call
out
people
doing,
doing
unethical
things.
And
what
Podbean
has
decided
that
it's
going
to
do
is,
again,
because
it
was
doing
this
a
couple
of
years
ago,
again,
it's
going
to
advertise
on
Google,
but
advertise
by
pretending
that
they
are
the
company
that
you
have
searched
for.
So
if
you
type
in
transistor,
for
example,
then
there
will
be
a
top
search
result
that
says
transistor
in
the
title,
but
you
click
on
it
and
it
goes
to
Podbean,
which
is.
I
mean,
it's
against
Ad
policy.
It
may
be
against
US
law.
It's
just
bad.
And
so.
But
what's
been
interesting
is
since
I
published
that
on
Monday,
everybody
has
been
coming
up
to
me
going,
oh,
Podbean,
eh?
And
they
are
a
supporter
of
Pod
News.
So,
you
know,
there
is
always
that.
But
as
ever,
they
haven't
actually
got
back
to
me
and
explained
themselves,
which
usually
means
that
they
can't
explain
themselves.
I
have
no
issue
with
guerrilla
marketing
where
you're
being
quite
aggressive,
but
I
think
if
you're
being
deceptive,
I
think
that's
crossing
the
line.
Yeah.
No,
indeed,
indeed.
No,
I
think
it
is
crossing
the
line
a
little
bit.
And
I
wish
that
people
would,
you
know,
do
the
job
properly,
I
guess.
Whizzing
over
to
Spain,
then
the
hundredth
edition
of
the
Audiogen
3x3
newsletter
has
been
published
and
you're
in
it,
James.
Why
I
am
in
it.
It's
talking
about
the
audio
industry,
the
global
spoken
audio
industry.
That's
an
interesting
way
of
putting
it,
isn't
it?
And
yes,
I'm
one
of
three
people
who've
been
interviewed
for
that.
You
asked
the
question
why?
It's
because
I'm
brilliant,
Sam.
That's.
That's
why.
Obviously.
Obviously.
So
who
are
the
other
two
people
then?
The
other
two
people?
Co
founder
of
Radio
Ambulante
Daniel
Alasson,
which
I've
probably
pronounced
incorrectly,
and
Lucas
Fridman,
who
is
from
Olga
in
Argentina.
And
it's,
you
know,
talking
about
radio
as
well
as
podcasting,
you
know,
and
all
of
that,
and
all
of
that
stuff.
So,
yeah,
so
it's
an
interesting
read.
If
you
speak
Spanish
and
if
you
don't
speak
Spanish,
translation
services
are
available,
which
is
always
a
good
thing.
And
I.
And
I
didn't
even
know
you
could
speak
Spanish.
But
there's
a
new
skill.
Yes,
well,
yeah,
yeah,
exactly.
Right,
I'm
back
to
where
you
are
in
your
homeland.
A
new
audio
creative
agency
has
been
born
in
Australia.
What
are
they?
Yes,
it's
a
new
company
called
Original
Audio.
I
believe
that
one
of
the
co
founders
comes
from
somewhere
else,
you
know,
somewhere
big
in
podcasting.
I'm
desperately
trying
to
remember
where
it
is,
but
I
can't
remember.
Anyway,
they're
calling
themselves
Australia's
AI
Driven
Audio
Creative
Agency.
They're
using
AI
to
do
some
of
their
audio
stuff.
They've
really
done.
Done
some
deals
with
some
technology
providers,
so.
But
an
AI
Driven
audio
creative
agency
is,
I
think,
is,
I
think,
quite
qu.
Interesting.
Now
I've
wandered
over
to
the
podpage
stand.
Dave
Jackson
from
the
school
of
podcasting
and
from
PodPage
is
here.
Greetings,
Dave.
Greetings,
James.
I
thought
I
would
come
over
because
I
know
that
you've
been
quite
lonely
over
here.
Thank
you
very
much.
So
I
thought
I'd
come
over
and
keep
you
company.
Has
it
been
for
you
here?
It's
been
lonely.
But
here's
the
thing
you
don't
realize.
I
talked
to
a
handful
of
people
yesterday
and
one
of
them
is
a
web
developer
and
he
was
like,
man,
I
really
love
your
stuff.
And
he
goes,
I
was
telling
all
my
friends
last
night,
if
you
have
podcasters,
you
got
to
check
this
thing
out.
So
it's
one
of
those
where
you
kind
of
like,
man,
I
only
talked
to,
you
know,
a
few
people
yesterday,
but
if
you
talk
to
the
right
people,
you
know,
it's
a
trickle
effect.
So.
But
it's,
it's
been
a
fun
show
and,
you
know,
lots
of
networking
and
Lots
of
things
that
make
me
scratch
my
head.
So
that's.
Oh,
yes.
Lots
of
things
that
make
you
scratch
your
head.
Go
on,
then.
My
favorite
one
was,
hey,
if
we
get
rid
of
the
word
podcast
for
people
on
YouTube,
then
we'll
have
to
call
them
YouTubers.
And
I
just
wanted
to
scream
out
and
what's
wrong
with
that?
But
I
did
not.
I,
you
know,
kept
myself
in
check.
There
are
quite
a
lot
of.
Yeah,
there
are
quite
a
lot
of
things
going,
why?
What
are
you
doing
that
for?
So,
yeah,
no,
it's
been.
It's
been
an
interesting.
It's
been
an
interesting
time.
How
many
steps
have
you
managed
to
get
in?
Literally
12
to
15,000
a
day.
And
that
is
not
the
norm
for
me.
So
it's
been
fun.
I
played
ping
pong
and
I
was
very
happy.
Just
the
fact
that
I'm
still
able
to
play
ping
pong.
I
used
to
do
that
quite
a
bit
when
I
was
young
and
I
was
like,
am
I
going
to
blow
out
my
knee
as
I
try
to,
you
know,
return
this
volley?
But
I
stayed
intact
and
did
not
lose.
So,
you
know,
that
was
another
fun
thing.
I
still
got
it,
apparently.
Most
impressive,
Dave.
Thank
you.
Tell
him,
hurry
up
and
get
another
edition
of
the
future
of
podcasting.
It's
been
about
9
million
weeks
since
he
did
one.
It
has.
And
it
turns
out.
Cause
Daniel
J.
Lewis
is
a
nice
guy.
Cause
he's
usually
the
guy
who's
like,
hey,
what
do
you
want
to
talk
about?
And
he
didn't
prod
me
because
I
had
lost
a
friend
of
mine,
Neil
Galarte,
and
he's
like,
I
wasn't
sure
if
you're
ready
to
get
back
on
the
mic.
And
I'm
like,
well,
I'm
back
on
the
mic
on
all
my
other
shows.
I
think
I'm
okay.
So,
yes,
we
were.
I've
hung
out
with
him
a
lot.
So,
yes,
there'll
be
a
new
one
very,
very
soon.
Excellent.
Good,
Good
news,
Sam.
I
think
there.
Exactly.
Yes,
my
queue
is
feeling
empty,
as
they
say.
Your
queue
is
empty,
is
it?
Oh,
well,
there
we
are.
Well,
your
queue
will
be
fuller.
Dave,
thank
you
so
much.
And
thank
you
for
your
support
with
the
school
of
podcasting
as
well.
Much
appreciated.
Yes,
always
keep
up
the
great
work,
guys.
Thank
you.
Now,
moving
on
to
people
in
jobs.
James,
your
friend
of
mine,
Rob
Walsh,
has
got
an
anniversary
to
celebrate.
What
is
it?
Yes,
he
did
a
talk
yesterday,
Very
good
talk.
All
about
podcast
statistics
and
things
like
that.
And
yes,
he
is
celebrating
20
years
as
of
this
week
in.
In
podcasting,
doing
podcasting
for
a
job.
So
yeah,
which
is
congratulations.
Which
is
quite
a
thing,
isn't
it?
Yeah,
indeed.
Who
else?
James
is
moving
and
grooving
in
the
industry.
Well,
I
will
tell
you
once
I've
scrolled
down.
David
Preva
has
been
made
head
of
podcast
at
SASE
Plus.
Now
David
Preva
used
to
be
on
a
ton
of
radio
stations
in
the
uk,
so
he
is
clearly
an
audio
veteran.
It'd
be
interesting
to
see
what
Sasee
is.
I
don't
know
much
about
it,
but
apparently
they
will
be
at
the
podcast
show
in
London
also.
What
else
have
we
got
here?
Leah
Rees
Dennis
has
been
promoted
to
head
of
podcasts
at
Audacy.
Audacy
making
a
couple
of
announcements
this
week,
including
a
free
podcast
host
because
we
all
want
one
of
those.
But
also
taking
their
podcorn
product
and
making
that
scalable
as
well.
That's
all
about
selling
host
red
ads
and
that
sort
of
thing.
So
that's
all
good.
And
David
Allen
Moss,
who
used
to
work
at
Evergreen
Podcasts,
he
is
now
an
advisor
to
the
Mercury
Podcast
Network
which
is
an
independent
podcast
network
I
think
based
in
the
UK
actually.
Liam.
Yeah,
so.
So
that's
all
good
news
from
that
point
of
view.
Moving
on
to
the
awards
and
events.
James,
you
were
probably
there
at
the
Ambies,
you
know,
the
American
Podcast
Awards.
What
happened?
Yeah,
the
Ambies
were
super
exciting.
They
were
on
Monday.
And
as
I,
as
I
stand
in
front
of
the
Podcast
Academy
stand
here,
I
can
actually
see
somebody
defl
the,
the
Ambies
statue
which
has
been
up
here
for
the
last,
for
the
last
three
days.
There
is
somebody
sitting
on
top
of
the
Ambies
statue
and
doing
that.
But
no,
a
super
good,
a
super
good
event
on
Monday
night.
It
feels
so
long
ago.
Tig
Notaro
hosting
that
hysterical
winning
podcast
of
the
year.
Ira
Glass
was
here
honoured
with
the
Governor's
Award
and
Sam
Sanders
receiving
the
Impact
Award
as
well.
There's
a
link
to
all
of
the
winners
and
an
OPML
feed.
Sam,
because
I
know
that
you
like
OPML
feeds,
I
imported
it
and
it
worked.
Linked
from
the
POD
link
from
the
Pod
News
newsletter
as
well.
So.
Yeah,
and
I
know
that
you
have
been
disparaging
them
and
calling
them
the
American
Podcast
Awards,
but
there
was
at
least
one
UK
winner
this
year,
I
notice.
Oh,
okay.
Who
was
that?
Yes,
yes,
I
was
hoping
you
weren't
going
to
ask
me
that
question
because
I
can't
remember
off
the
top
of
my
head.
But
that's
about.
But
that's
about
as
far
as
we
go.
That's
it.
And
the
other
one
was
there
was
nine
newly
elected
people
to
the
Podcast
Academy.
Right.
And
I
was
going,
really?
Because
all
the
names
that
are
on
that
list
look
like
names
that
have.
Been
there
before,
but
they
are
re
elected.
I
think
most
of
them
are
reelected.
You
serve
two
years
on
the.
Unlike
the
U.S.
president
now.
Yeah,
okay.
You
serve
two
years
and
then
you
can
stand
for
re
election.
And
essentially
half
of
them
run
out
one
year
and
half
of
them
run
out
the
next
year,
if
you
see
what
I
mean.
Gotcha.
Which,
you
know,
keeps
things.
Keeps
things
going
from
that
point
of
view.
Other
awards,
James.
The
Webbies.
The
nominees
for
the
29th
annual
Webby
Awards
were
announced
and
the
event
is
going
to
be
on
Monday,
May
12th
in
New.
So
you've
got
a
Webby,
haven't
you?
Oh,
oh,
yeah,
yeah.
When
you
say
a
Webby,
I
think
you'll
find
I've
got
two.
But
yes.
Same
joke
every
year.
But
we
have
to
do
it.
Same
joke
every
year.
Exactly.
There've
been
lots
of
people
on
stage
here
at
this
event,
and
there
were
two
lawyers
on
stage.
It's
never
good.
I
know.
Which
I
know
I
don't
know
what.
The
collective,
Gordon
Firemark,
the
podcast
lawyer.
What
is
the
collective
of
lawyers?
The
collective
of
lawyers.
Well,
there's
a
handful
of
us
that
do
this
stuff
in
this
space,
and
frankly,
that's
more
than
enough.
It's
a
handful
of
lawyers.
And
how
have
you
felt
this.
This
event.
This
event
has
been
overall
good,
A
little.
The
vibe
has
been
a
little
slow,
I
guess
I
would
say.
But
I've
met
some
great
people
and
really
enjoyed
myself.
And
so
you
were
on
stage
with
Lindsay
Bowen.
What
was
the
big
takeaway
from
that
particular
thing?
Well,
our
talk
is
about
a
particular
kind
of
contract
deal,
shopping
agreements,
where
a
producer
in
air
quotes
will
take
your
podcast
and
try
to
get
it
developed
into
a
film
or
television
project
or
something
like
that.
And
the
title
of
the
presentation
was
Dupe.
Shopping
agreements
suck.
And
we
could
have
answered
it
in
one
word.
So
the
answer
was,
yes,
they
suck.
Sam
has
a
question.
What
do
you
call
a
hundred
lawyers
at
the
bottom
of
the
sea?
Oh,
Sam,
I'm
not
repeating
that
to
him.
What
do
you
call
100
lawyers
at
the
bottom
of
the
sea?
A
good
start.
A
good
start.
Gordon.
Thank
you
so
much.
Really
appreciate
it.
You
made
me
repeat
that
to
him.
Exactly.
Now,
I
like
Gordon
very
much,
so
he
can
be
one
of
the
exceptions
to
the
rule.
The
tech
stuff
on
the
Pod
News
Weekly
review.
Ah,
yes,
yes.
It's
the
stuff
you'll
find
every
Monday
in
the
Pod
News
newsletter.
And
here's
where
Sam
talks
technology.
What's
Going
on
Casts
running
out
smart
folders
next
week,
which
is
quite
neat.
Well,
yeah.
Do
you
know
anything
more
about
that?
No.
They've
got
folders
already,
so
I
don't
know
what
adding
the
word
smart
in
front
of
the
word
folders
will
do
to
them,
but
it
automatically
groups
them
together
by
shows,
so
maybe
they've
just
gone
and
enabled
the
categorization
to
allow
you
to
have
news
automatically
in
one
folder
and
comedy
in
another.
Sounds
like
that.
It's
very
clever.
And
obviously,
as
you
showed
from
the
podcast
report
card,
that,
you
know,
it's
a
very
popular
app
as
well,
so
well
done.
So
you
can
play
around
with
that
now
if
you're
on
the
beta,
and
if
you're
not
on
the
beta,
it's
coming
any
minute
now.
Also,
Apple
released
a
new
version
of
iOS
18.4,
now
available
as
an
update
for
iPhone
and
iPad.
For
podcast
fans,
two
new
home
screen
widgets.
So
if
you're
a
big
fan
of
a
particular
show,
maybe
you're
a
big
fan
of
this
show,
you
can
put
this
show
as
a
widget
onto
your
home
screen.
So
you've
always
got
access
to
the
latest
episode.
I'm
not
quite
sure
whether
or
not
that's
an
amazing
thing
for
this,
but
nevertheless,
certainly
worthwhile
checking
out
the
widgets
once
you've
upgraded.
Oh,
I'm
very
glad
that
one
developer
has
done
something.
So
it's
good
now.
He's
been
here.
He's
been
here
and
apparently,
I
should
tell
you,
Sam,
apparently
he's
quite.
We
kind
of
get
the
understanding.
Understanding
that
Apple
would
like
to
point
out
that
they
don't
just
have
one
developer,
they
don't
have
a
lot
more.
But
I
mean,
let
me
put
it,
you
know,
the
productivity
of
the
UK
is
exceptionally
low.
Apple
is
below
it.
I
mean,
what
are
they
doing?
Yes,
no,
it's
been,
It's.
It's
certainly
been.
It's
certainly
been,
you
know,
entertaining,
but
still,
there
we
are.
Hey,
let's
go
on
to
our
favorite
time
of
the
week.
Boostergrams,
Boostergram
Super
Super
Comments,
Zaps,
Fan
mail,
Fan
mail,
Super
Chats
and
email.
Our
favorite
time
of
the
week,
it's
the
POD
News
Weekly
review
inbox.
Yes.
So
many
different
ways
to
get
in
touch
with
us.
Fan
by
using
the
link
in
our
show
Notes.
Super
comments.
True
fans,
Boosts
everywhere
as
well.
We
share
any
money
that
we
make
too.
We've
got
some
boosts,
which
is
always
nice.
Yes,
we've
got
one
from
BR,
a
thousand
sats
from
Podverse,
Pod
News
Weekly
Review,
podcasting
3.0
exclamation
mark
question
and
the
infinite
dial.
Yes,
we
did
have
the
infinite
dial.
And
it
looks
like
I've
been
approved
to
talk
at
the
London
Podcast
show
on
podcasting
3.0
Agentic
AI
and
the
future
of
advertising.
Yes,
well,
that
was
a
thousand
sats
from
Ben
Richardson
of
all
people,
so
that
was
nice.
Now
we
know
exactly
who
he
is.
A
row
of
ducks
From
Silas
on
Linux.
22:22
SATS
talking
about
his
political
positioning,
which
is
everything
is
stupid.
I
think
we
were
making
a
joke
about
what
his
political
positioning
was.
I
always
try
to
listen
what
someone
has
to
say
and
then
decide
on
that
individual
thing.
Do
I
agree
or
not?
Correct.
I
don't
like
the
reductive
left
versus
right
thing.
Correct.
And
he
also
is
talking
about
Napster
and
the
name
and
the
history
of
the
Napster
brand,
which
of
course
I
think
was
part
of
real
networks
at
some
point.
So
yes,
very
good
to
hear
from
Silas.
Now
you
were
mentioning
a
little
while
ago,
we've
just
told
off
Dave
Jackson
for
not
publishing
the
future
of
podcasting.
Here's
a
man
who
has
a
mouthful
of
sweets.
So
I'm
currently
a
mouthful
of
candy
just
to
translate.
And
so
I'm
just
talking
until
he
finishes
that
mouthful
of
sweets.
It's
the
one
and
only
Daniel
J.
Lewis.
How
are
you,
Daniel?
I
am
wonderful.
It's
great
to
see
you
in
person.
Great
to
be
around
so
many
other
podcasters.
Great
to
be
on
POD
News
Weekly
Review.
Yes,
yes,
well
guessed.
And
so
we
were
just
curious
when's
the
future
of
podcasting
your
podcast
with
Dave
Jackson
coming
back?
We're
gonna
have
a
future
episode
about
or
follow
up
episode
about
podcast
movement
because
there's
certainly
a
lot
to
talk
about
from
here.
The
video
stuff,
some
of
the
new
things
developing
in
AI.
So
within
the
next
couple
of
weeks.
Excellent.
And
what
else
is
new
with
POD
Gaugement
and
everything
else
that
you're
doing?
Well,
the
six
years
of
charts
and
ranking
history
that
I've
been
tracking
was
stored
in
the
wrong
format.
So
it
has
been
taking
months
for
it
to
reconvert
re
import
do
all
of
this
stuff
re
index
all
this
geeky
nerdy
database
stuff
in
the
background
that
is
finally
coming
to
a
close
within
the
next
few
days.
So
I'm
excited
to
have
that
so
people
can
see
the
ranking
history
for
six
years
in
then
the
SEO
tracking
feature.
Very
good,
very
good.
Oh,
I'm
more
SEO
tracking.
There's
a
thing.
I'm
looking
forward
to
that.
Daniel,
always
a
pleasure.
Thank
you
so
much.
Thank
you.
Keep
podcasting.
Thank
you.
Right,
let's
move
on.
Seth,
1,000
sats
from.
No.
11,
92
sats
from
him.
That's
a
slightly
bizarre
number,
isn't
it?
But
it's
because
he
would
have
paid
in
a
fiat
currency
because
he
carries
it
on.
There's
a
dice,
isn't
there?
There's
a
dice
image
there.
There
probably
does
mean
something.
Well,
that's.
I'm
not
sure
what
that
means,
but
the.
The
odd
SATs
number
will
be.
Because
he
would
have
paid
in
SAT
in
fiat,
and
we
would
have
translated
that
into
sats
for
us.
Well,
none
of
it
makes
any
sense
to
me
anyway.
He
says,
he
says.
He
says,
isn't
it.
So
this
is
following
the
news
that
Spotify,
lots
of
people
have
been
uploading
porn
to
Spotify.
He
says.
Isn't
that
when
you
know
you've
made
it
as
a
service,
when
porn
has
infiltrated
your
platform?
Which
I
think
is
absolutely.
That's
the
word
we're
looking
for.
But
anyway.
Absolutely
correct.
Bruce
the
ugly
quacking
duck.
A
row
of
ducks.
Double
two.
Double
two
sats
from
him.
I
enjoy
episodes,
he
says,
that
contain
part
of
all
remote
recording.
It
shows
the
host
went,
oh,
part
or
all
remote
recording?
It
went.
It
shows
the
hosts
went
above
and
beyond,
not
just
in
the
comfortable
studio.
Thanks
for
both
of
what
you
do.
And
then
he
signs
it
off
by
73,
which
73
being
some
amateur
radio
thing
that
I
don't
fully
understand,
but
here's
a
man
who
does.
I'm
at
the
blueberry
stand,
which
has
some
very
nice
pens.
Thank
you,
Todd,
for
spending
all
that
money
on
those
pens.
Here's
Mike
Dell.
Hello,
Mike.
Hey,
how
you
doing?
What
does
73
mean?
It
is
a
radiogram
for.
And
it
means
best
regards.
Best
regards.
Do
you
hear
that,
Sam?
Yes.
Yeah.
Very
nice.
Yeah.
So.
So
how's.
How's
the
show
been
for
you,
Mike?
Pretty
good.
Had
some
good
meetings,
good
conversations.
Booth
traffic
is
not
so
great,
but
otherwise
awesome.
Yeah,
no,
it's
been.
It's
been
good.
It's
been
a
bit
weird
because
you
are
in
a
part
of
the.
Of
the
hall
here
that
is
basically
turned
off
in
the
morning
while
the
keynotes
are.
Are
on.
So
I
hope
you
appreciated
that
my
keynote
was
only
15
minutes
long.
Yeah,
it
was
great.
A
little
dark
over
here,
though.
Yeah,
it
does.
It
gets.
It
gets
a
little
bit
dark
over
here,
but
no,
it's
been.
It's
been
good.
Excellent
to.
To
see
you.
Of
course.
Todd
is
in
warmer
climes,
isn't.
Isn't
he?
But
I
have
a
feeling
that
we
will
see
Todd
at
the
big
podcast
movement
in
Dallas.
Yes.
Yeah.
Sure.
He'll
be
there
in
London.
London?
He's
coming
to
London?
He's
confirmed.
Oh
yeah,
Todd's
going
to
London
also
with
Dave.
I
don't
know
if
you've
met
him,
but
he's
one
of
my
support
guys.
Oh,
who's
Dave?
One
of
your
support
guys.
Wow,
okay,
excellent.
Why
does
Dave
have
to
go
to
London
then?
I'm
allergic
to
long
plane
flights
and.
Todd
needs
someone
to
carry
the
bags.
With
your
background,
Mike,
I'm
surprised
that
you
are
allergic
to
long
to
long
plane
flights.
Really
good
to
see
you.
Good
to
see
you
Mackenzie
as
well.
And
yeah,
so
every,
everybody's
still,
still
here
on
the,
on
the
final
day,
Sam.
It's
all
quite
fun.
Back
to
the
boost
scrambs
then.
Neil
Velio,
friend
of
the
show,
sent
304sats
from
true
fans
saying
thank
you
so
much
for
the
get
well
message.
I
love
you
guys.
Yes,
get
well
soon,
Neil.
See
you
in
London
with
the
London
podcast
show.
Yes
indeed.
And
thank
you
as
well
to
our
power
supporters.
Talking
about,
you
know,
all
new
news
from
Patreon
this
week.
Of
course
you
can
support
this
show
by
going
to
weekly.podnews.net
with
Armed
with
your
credit
card.
We
take
all
major
credit
cards
probably.
And
yes,
we've
now
got
18
excellent
supporters.
Oh,
there's
a
round
of
applause
going
on.
That's
exciting,
isn't
it?
Perfectly
timed
really.
Yes,
perfect.
Perfectly
timed
for
our
18
power
supporters.
Star
Tempest,
who
is
the
latest
one
of
those,
got
in
touch
and
she
said,
I'm
not
anyone
special,
just
someone,
someone
who's
had
you
as
part
of
my
weekly
routine
for
years.
Thought
it
was
time
to
give
something
back.
Thank
you
very
much.
35
years
old,
she
says.
Most
of
my
time
spent
between
the
Midlands,
East
Anglia
and
County
Durham
and
I'm
a
PHP
developer.
I
must
have
been
a
bad
person
in
a
previous
life.
I'm
a
PHP
developer.
How
dare
you.
And
she
goes
on
to
say,
I
think
the
modern
Silicon
Valley
led
tech
landscape
is
a
load
of
something
bad.
And
so
open
source,
open
RSS
and
privacy
are
some
passions
of
mine.
Along
with
podcasts
of
course.
Well,
thank
you
so
much
Star,
if
that
is
your
real
name
for
being
the
18th
weekly
supporters.
Our
other
weekly
supporters
are
Cameron
Moll,
Marshall
Brown,
Matt
Medeiros,
Mike
Hamilton,
Dave
Jackson,
who
we
spoke
to
earlier,
Rachel
Corbett,
Sy
Job,
David
Marzel,
John
James,
no,
Jim
James,
Rocky
Thomas,
who's
been
here
as
well,
Neil
Vellomer,
Zylene
Smith,
Claire
wake
Brown,
John
McDermott,
James
Burt
and
David
John
Clark
as
well
as
Brian
Entsminger
John
McDermott
from
Kalaroga
Shark
Media
here.
Earlier
on
in
the
week
we
shared
an
almost
satisfactory
American
beer
together.
So
that
was
definitely
a
good
thing.
Nice.
So
Sam,
what
have
you
been
doing
all
week
while
I've
been
gambling
around
the
world?
Pining.
Pining
is
one
thing
I've
been
doing.
Wishing
I
was
there
with
you.
But
the
other
things
I've
been
doing.
We
improved
our
offline
support
for
true
fans
this
week.
So
now
we
can
actually
track
your
activity.
So
your
listening
activity,
any
micro
payments
you
pay
while
you're
offline,
we
store
that
locally
and
sync
it
when
you
go
back
online,
which
I
thought
was
quite
a
nice
thing
to
do.
And
the
other
thing
I'm
very
interested
in
is
I'm
reading
a
lot
more
about
something
that's
come
across
my
table
called
llhls.
Not
that
we
need
another
acronym
in
the
industry.
Oh
great.
Yes,
Low
Latency
hls.
And
it's
really
quite
clever
in
that
it
does
per
second
streaming
as
opposed
to
every
six
or
ten
second
chunks,
which
is
what
HLS
does.
And
I
think
what
it
gives
you
is
immediacy
of
audio
or
video
because
it's
already
stored
and
ready
to
go
and
it's
constantly
doing
it.
But
it
also
gives
you
all
the
capabilities
of
rewind
and
if
you're
going
to
do
things
like
voice
related
Alexa
skills
and
stuff,
you
need
this
type
of
technology.
So
I'm
reading
up
about
it
and
I
find
it
really
interesting.
Yeah,
well
you'll
be
surprised
to
know
that
there
are
actually
quite
a
lot
of
technical
conversations
going
on
around
HLS
at
this
conference.
So
clearly
HLS
is
a
thing
which
people
are
thinking
about,
which
is
nice.
So
you
know,
more,
more
of
that
the
better
so
far
as
I'm
concerned
because
it's
particularly
useful
for
video,
of
course.
And
last
thing,
I'm
up
in
Birmingham,
so.
Oh
yes,
I'm
at
the
Uni
podfar
Uni
Pod
Fest
Festival.
Uni
Podcast
Festival.
Let
me
try
that
again.
Yes.
So
I'm
up
here
with
Nina
Robinson
and
Megan
Bradshaw's
up
here
and
Claire
Wait
Brown
and
quite
a
few
other
people.
So.
So
yeah,
looking
forward
to
that.
Yes,
very
good.
That
should
be.
That
should
be
fun.
What
has
happened
for
you,
James,
apart
from
drinking
with
Mr.
McDermott
and
rolling
around
the
aisles
and
keynoting
what
else
you
been
up
to?
Yes,
yes,
well,
and
also
enjoying
a
deep
dish
pizza
because
obviously
I'm
in
Chicago
and
so
therefore
a
deep
dish
pizza
is
a
thing.
Wasn't
that
impressed.
So
that's
been
good.
But
yeah,
no,
it's
Just
been
good
running
around,
meeting
people,
you
know,
doing
an
awful
lot
of
talking
as
you
can
tell
from
the
state
of
my
voice
at
the
moment.
And
yeah,
no
it's
been,
it's
been
all
good
fun.
Looking
forward
to
going
home
though
tomorrow
because
that'll
be
a
very
pleasant
thing.
And
then
I've
got
my
80
year
old
parents
in
my
house
for
the
next
two
weeks
coming
all
the
way
to
Australia,
so.
So
that's
going
to
be
fun,
bless
them.
Now
one
thing
that
I'll
picked
up
through
all
the
conversations
you
kindly
brought
onto
this
show
is
that
there
wasn't
a
lot
of
traffic
in
the
booths.
Yeah,
there
are
1600
people
here
so
it's,
it's
still
big,
it's
still
a
big
event
and
all
of
that.
Some
of
the
booths
are
in
slightly
weird
places
and
so
quite
difficult
to
get
to.
So
that
the.
And
also
it's
very
spread
out
and
so
POD
News
sponsored
the
industry
track.
The
industry
track
is
downstairs.
I'm
upstairs
at
the
moment.
I've
been
down,
down
downstairs
once.
There
are
lounges
and
things
around
the
place
and
everything
else
and
as
you've
heard
a
lot
of
people
talking
about
walking,
everything
is
very,
very
spread
out
here.
And
so
I
think
what
we've
seen
is,
you
know,
the
effect
that
a
very
large
venue
has
on
1600
people.
So
I
don't
think
things
have
been
quite
as
busy
as
some
people
were
expecting
but
of
the
conversations
that
we've
had,
the
conversations
have
still
been
absolutely
gold,
you
know,
as
Dave
was
saying
earlier.
So
yeah,
so
I
think,
you
know,
it's
a
pretty
good
event.
Interestingly,
we
don't
yet
have
a
date
or
a
venue
for
evolutions
next
year.
So
I
don't
know
whether
to
read
anything
into
that,
that.
But
that's
about
as
far
as,
as
far
as
we
know
there.
And
in
terms
of,
you
know,
in,
in
terms
of.
Of
course
the
big
one
is
podcast
movement
in
Dallas
which
is
in
August.
Next
up
though
for
you,
James,
is
come
back
to
Blighty
for
the
London
podcast
show
at
the
end
of
May.
Indeed,
which
I'm
very
much
looking
forward
to.
And
that's
it
for
this
week.
All
of
our
podcast
stories
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from
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Pod
News
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